"Unemployed", by Oswald Chambers

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"Unemployed", by Oswald Chambers
Topic Started: May 28 2009, 10:11 AM (383 Views)
Ruth	May 28 2009, 10:11 AM Post #1
Advanced Member Posts: 1,385 Group: Advanced Members Member #4,840 Joined: August 9, 2008	I am reading a biography of Oswald Chambers "Abandoned To God" by David McCasland. In my reading thus far Oswald is a young man of 21, called to London to start preaching for the Lord, he is also very artistic. He was over come by the poverty in London, and was himself unemployed, he wrote this poem. Something to ponder..does God always provide? If so why do believers starve to the point of death? Also in a verse of this poem, Oswald writes, women must sin to get bread, because many women were not offered employment. I find this promise from Jesus confusing at times, I think Oswald did to. Luke 12 27 "Consider how the wildflowers grow: they don't labor or spin thread. Yet I tell you, not even Solomon in all his splendor was adorned like one of these! 28 If that's how God clothes the grass, which is in the field today and is thrown into the furnace tomorrow, how much more will He do for you—you of little faith? 29 Don't keep striving for what you should eat and what you should drink, and don't be anxious. 30 For the Gentile world eagerly seeks all these things, and your Father knows that you need them. UNEMPLOYED (London, February 27, 1895) We are the unemployed, By want of work, annoyed, Of rest and peace devoid That's why we rave We have got minds that think But thoughts and passions link To drive us to the brink-- Oh dire despair We have got hearts that cling To ever holy thing, But want of bread doth bring Intensest hate We knew the love of some Now starved to death and dumb Whose spirits often come and pain our hearts We feel our need to pray, But hunger rules the day Starvation shrieks its sway: We must have bread. Oh God, our ranks are thin, Our children's hearts are dim, and must our women sin to gain us bread? O rise, great God, at last Ere reason from us cast And revolutions blast Blacken our name. by: Oswald Chambers



KimR	May 28 2009, 04:24 PM Post #2
Advanced Member Posts: 402 Group: Members Member #4,913 Joined: September 30, 2008	This is one of those things that is hard to answer but this is how I look at it. On this earth, we are disciplined & tested by God and tempted by Satan. By our suffering and perserverance, our faith is being made perfect. James 1:2-4. Consider it pure joy, my brothers, whenever you face trials of many kinds, because you know that the testing of your faith develops perseverance. Perseverance must finish its work so that you may be mature and complete, not lacking anything. We have to remain confident in the goodness and sovereignty of our Father until the end. He provides for the birds of the air, yes, but only until their time is up. He will take care of us until our time is up on this earth. Heb 3:14. We have come to share in Christ if we hold firmly till the end the confidence we had at first. We were never told we would not suffer. We just need to remember that He will not give us more than He has equipped us to handle. -Kim



Ruth	May 28 2009, 05:01 PM Post #3
Advanced Member Posts: 1,385 Group: Advanced Members Member #4,840 Joined: August 9, 2008	thanks for sharing Kim, I agree, the mistake I guess I make in reading scripture sometimes is seeing a passage or teaching, as a promise, such as He will always provide, but like you showed with scripture, there is a time when our end comes, and a time of suffering for all of us. Well isn't this a happy conversation, LOL, :)



KimR	May 28 2009, 05:59 PM Post #4
Advanced Member Posts: 402 Group: Members Member #4,913 Joined: September 30, 2008	Ruth, no this is not a happy conversation, but I think you brought up a very good point. I thought more about this on my commute home. Quote: Oswald writes, women must sin to get bread, because many women were not offered employment. I tried to put myself in this situation in my imagination where I would be forced to choose between sinning and starvation. A scenario like this: I would be unemployed, homeless, no possessions to sell/trade, no friends or family to ask for help, no churches to ask for help, no govt programs, no homeless shelters, no welfare/food stamps, and no means of obtaining food by gathering/fishing. It is just me and the clothes on my back. I still think I would have choices. I could knock on doors offering to do odd jobs for a meal (not money). I could beg on the street. I could gather aluminum cans. I would work all day in a field picking whatever. I would go through trash bins behind resturants for food. My pride would not prevent me from doing these things before choosing between starving or sinning like stealing or prostitution. If all of these fail, I would eventually starve myself into sickness, pass out and be taken to a hospital or die. Or I would be picked up for vagrancy and put in jail where at least I would get regular meals. This lead me to think about Jesus in the desert where He was being tested by God for 40 days. Satan came to Him at His weakest point, near the end of the 40 days, to offer Him some easy ways out of His suffering flesh. Jesus' choice was continued starvation or sin. He remained faithful to His Father's will and did not sin and I believe that He would make a way for me to also if I was faced with the same temptation from Satan and did not give into the temptation. He will always give us a way out. Even if we ended up in jail or internment camp, we could still praise Him and seek what work He wants us to do for His Kingdom while we are there, like John on Patmos. -Kim



KimR	May 29 2009, 10:10 AM Post #5
Advanced Member Posts: 402 Group: Members Member #4,913 Joined: September 30, 2008	Ruth, I wanted to clarify something about my above post. I do not believe that I am ready in anyway to suffer in this way yet. It will take a special annointing of the Holy Spirit to walk in this type of suffering and not sin. I am confident that if any of us are called to this, that the annointing will occur immediately beforehand to endure our cup of suffering patiently. A while back, I started a bible study on suffering which I never completed but will need to get back to. One of the first things that struck me, is how many times suffering for God's Kingdom is discussed in the NT after the Gospels: Acts, Romans, Thess 1 & 2, 2nd Timothy, Hebrews, James, 1st Peter. I am convinced that something that discussed this often would apply to us at some point. I am not sure where I read this at, but after the Christian persecution in China began, a missionary was expressing their deep regret that the Chinese Christians were never taught about suffering. The missionaries felt they had let them down. They taught them all about the joy of the Lord, the spiritual gifts, etc., but not about patient endurance while suffering for God's Kingdom. American Christianity is not ready and no one is preparing us. -Kim



Ruth	May 29 2009, 08:03 PM Post #6
Advanced Member Posts: 1,385 Group: Advanced Members Member #4,840 Joined: August 9, 2008	thanks for sharing Kim, I hope I would do the same, and not sin during a time of great suffering. Only by the grace of God go I.



justme	May 30 2009, 11:44 AM Post #7
Advanced Member Posts: 725 Group: Advanced Members Member #2,410 Joined: December 17, 2007	Good discussion here. And one too often overlooked by the church. The bible speaks often about suffering, but the church neglects to preach on it. Preferring instead the well received messages of abundance and the like. Since many of God's people will suffer lack and hard time the scriptures are full of wisdom and hope for just such a time. I believe as long as we neglect this message we endanger more to fall by the wayside when troubles come. Yet instead of preparing God's people the ministers so often point out the blessings of God thinking this will bring in more souls perhaps. Job is a hard book to read smetimes, especially given our present day teachings of the goodness of God. The first time I read it I felt like crawling into a dust heap. It really brought me down. I could not imagine going through that for 9 months. Which is how long I heard he had to suffer. But the bible pulls no punches in stating we will not be exempt from such suffering if we stick to this path we walk. I would rather hear this message up front and know what to expect than to only get the happy side of the gospel and wonder what happened when things go bad. It is in the midst of suffering our faith is made perfect. And God delights in the suffering of his saints for that very reason. Anybody can follow Christ when things are going good. It is when we do not know where our next meal is coming from, or where we will bed down that will seperate the true believers from the pretenders. This message needs to get out more because suffering and persecution is coming soon. And we better prepare our hearts to cling to that old rugged cross. Which by the way is a symbol of tremendous suffering and pain. Paul spoke often of denying self and taking up the cross. Yet here in america we do not even know what that means anymore. I will cling to the old rugged cross .....and exchange it some day for a crown.
	The Lord gives us the poor to test our level of selfishness.


lionschild	Jun 7 2009, 07:49 PM Post #8
Advanced Member Posts: 573 Group: Advanced Members Member #2,333 Joined: December 11, 2007	This is an interesting topic for me also. Twenty years ago our young family went to work in overseas missions. We were supported by our church and friends here at home and got by on a very meager amt of $. I had always believed that God would abundantly provide what was necessary such as food etc because that is what I had always been taught as a Christian. Many times in the two years overseas I found myself hungry and without the means to buy even basics (never starving but definitely hungry) I learned allot about how my "church taught" Christianity was very lacking in teaching anything about suffering for the Lord. I spent 2 years being angry that I had to do without hot water,electricity and even food at some times. I wouldn't give those times up for anything though as I believe they taught me allot about how to endure the days ahead. Also I remember as a kid my dad telling me that if you get hungry enough you will eat anything. I dont believe that. When I got hungry enough I got tired and wanted to sleep. I could see myself just getting weak and not careing or getting sick as Kim mentioned.
	The King has need of thee!


KimR	Jun 8 2009, 09:02 AM Post #9
Advanced Member Posts: 402 Group: Members Member #4,913 Joined: September 30, 2008	Lionschild, that is an amazing testimony. I would love to hear more. Do you have any advice to share with us that would help us keep our faith up when facing hard times? Are there any scriptures in particular that helped you? -Kim



gibby62	Jun 8 2009, 10:34 AM Post #10
Adopted Child of God Posts: 2,679 Group: Advanced Members Member #4,933 Joined: October 29, 2008	This may seem like "cheating", but we have bought some Hoodia which is supposed to help with appetite suppression. It is used in Africa for the same reason. It won't be used to lose weight, but to help with hunger issues.
	Put on the full armor of God so that you can take your stand against the devil's schemes. For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the authorities, against the powers of this dark world and against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly realms. Eph 6:11-12


lionschild	Jun 10 2009, 01:19 AM Post #11
Advanced Member Posts: 573 Group: Advanced Members Member #2,333 Joined: December 11, 2007	Quote: Lionschild, that is an amazing testimony. I would love to hear more. Do you have any advice to share with us that would help us keep our faith up when facing hard times? Are there any scriptures in particular that helped you? -Kim I wish I could say I passed that test but sadly I did not and I complained until we finally returned home and eventually I completely rebelled against God for 7 years. I can say today that I trust God no matter what he has in store for me. I never want to be without him again. I learned that we need to be of the frame of mind that Job was when he said "though God slay me yet will I serve him". We've got to learn to die to ourselves. That's when we will no longer walk in fear. I'm very concerned about the condition of most Christians and how they are going to react when hard times hit them. We are so spoiled in this country.
	The King has need of thee!


KimR	Jun 10 2009, 02:38 PM Post #12
Advanced Member Posts: 402 Group: Members Member #4,913 Joined: September 30, 2008	LC, your honesty is appreciated. Even though it was very, very hard, God led you through full circle and here you are. I do not expect any us to do any better than the Israelites did when they spent 40 years in the desert complaining. That is, we could not do better without the help of the Holy Spirit. I am now in the mindframe to study Job once again after sharing that verse with me: "though God slay me yet will I serve him". Thank you. I frequently grieve in spiritual prayer for Christians today and how they will handle the suffering to come. We are so used to instant gratification and have taken so many blessings for granted. We listen more to our flesh than our spirit. The fear they will experience will be overwhelming if they are not spiritual prepared. On the last anniversary of 9/11, I watched a movie about the tragedy. This was the first time I watched anything like this since it happened. During 9/11, the professional people didn't know what to do or how to save themselves, because they were so overwhelmed with fear. The maintenance men and the other blue collar workers could think and not only saved themselves but many, many others. I was stuck in particular about the story of one professional man who just sat down on the stairs when all he had to do was too keep walking down and out of the building. Several co-workers had tried to talk him into continuing but he just sat down. It was too hard for him emotionally. He just gave up. He left behind a wife, children. I think this will happen with spiritually unprepared people in the times to come, especially when they have only focused on themselves. Everyone really needs to make sure that they have a true, close relationship with God BEFORE these times come upon us. Knowing it all in your head is not enough, it must be in your heart. -Kim



outcast	Jun 15 2009, 03:47 PM Post #13
Member Posts: 69 Group: Members Member #5,064 Joined: May 20, 2009	Not that I speak in regard to need, for I have learned in whatever state I am, to be content: I know how to be abased, and I know how to abound. Everywhere and in all things I have learned both to be full and to be hungry, both to abound and to suffer need. I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me. Philippans 4:11-13



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