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| When to turn the other cheek | |
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| Topic Started: Aug 15 2008, 03:08 PM (224 Views) | |
| w8n4him | Aug 15 2008, 03:08 PM Post #1 |
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It is widely accepted that Jesus taught a higher ethic epitomized in his statement, “Turn the other cheek.” This has led to the belief that when attacked, one should not injure or kill in order to defend self, family or country. The idea that pacifism was a part of the teaching of Jesus was popularized in the writings of Tolstoy. Pacifism, however, is not today, nor was it ever, a part of Jewish belief. Jewish writings state “If someone comes to kill you, anticipate him and hill him first.” In other words, it is permissible to kill in order to defend oneself. Can it be then, that Jesus was the first and only Jew to teach pacifism? It is very unlikely. We know that at least some of Jesus’ disciples were armed (Luke 22:38; 22:50). Add to this the fact that at one point, Jesus even suggested to his disciples that they purchase swords (Luke 22:35-37), and we begin to ask ourselves Did Jesus really believe or teach pacifism? In reality, pacifism is a theological misunderstanding based on several mistranslations of the sayings of Jesus. The first of these mistranslations is Matthew 5:21, where most English versions of the Bible read, “You shall not kill.” This is a quotation of Exodus 20:13. The Hebrew word used there is “murder” (ratzach), and not kill (harag). In Hebrew there is a clear distinction between these two words. The first (ratzach) means premeditated murder, while the second (harag) encompasses everything from justifiable homicide, manslaughter and accidental killing, to taking the life of an enemy soldier in war. The commandment very precisely prohibits murder, but not the taking of a life in defense of oneself or others. It is difficult to explain how English translators made this mistake since the Greek language also has separate words for “murder” and “kill,” and it is the Greek word for “murder” (not”kill”) which is used in Matthew 5:21. Even with no knowledge of Hebrew, the English translators of the New Testament should here have correctly translated “murder,” and not “kill.” A second saying of Jesus onl which pacifism is based is Matthew 5:39, usually translated, “Do not resist evil,” or “Do not resist one who is evil.” Could Jesus possibly have said this to his disciples? If he did, his statement contradicts other scriptures such as, “Hate what is evil” (Romans 12:9), and “Resist the devil” (James 4:7). Again, Hebrew provides the answer. When we translate this verse back into Hebrew, we see that Jesus was not creating a new saying, but quoting a well-known Old Testament proverb. This proverb appears, with slight variations, in Psalm 37:1,8, and Proverbs 24:19. In modern English we would translate this maxim: “Don’t compete with evildoers.” In other words, do not try to rival or vie with a neighbor who has wronged you. Jesus is not teaching that one should lie down in the face of evil or submit to evil; rather, he is teaching that we should forego trying to “get back at,” or take revenge on a quarrelsome neighbor. As Proverbs 24:29 says: “Do not say, ‘I will do him as he has done to me. I will pay the man back for what he has done.’” Jesus is expressing an important principle which applies to our relationships with friends and neighbors. It does not apply when we are confronted with a murderer, rapist, or like person of violence; nor when we are facing the enemy on the field of battle. Jesus is not talking about how to deal with violence. He is talking about the fundamentals of brotherly relationships, about how to relate to our neightbor. If, for instance, a neighbor dumps a pail of garbage on our lawn, we are not to retaliate by dumping two pails on his lawn. If someone cuts in front of us in traffic, we are not to catch up and try to run him off the road. Wanting to “get even” is, of course, a natural response; however, it is not our responsibility to punish our neighbor for his action. That responsibility is God’s. We are to respond to our neighbor in a way that will disarm and shame him for his actions. Provergs 25:21 says: “If your enemy is hungry, give him bread to eat, and if he is thirsty, give him water to drink. In so doing, you heap red-hot coals on his head, and the Lord will reward you.” Once we discover how to correctly translate Matthew 5:39, we can then correctly understand the verses which follow. Each verse is an illustration of how we should react to a hostile neighbor. If for example (Matthew 5:39), a friend unsults and embarrasses us by slapping us on the cheek, we are not to slap him back, but instead, offer our other cheek. This, by the way, is probably the best-known of all sayings of Jesus. It is also another of the sayings on which pacifism is based. Properly understood, however, it has nothing to do with battlefield situations, defending oneself against a murderer, or resisting evil. It is an illustration of how to deal with an angry neighbor, a personal “enemy.” Mistranslation of Matthew 5:39 has created a theological contradiction. But when this saying is understood Hebraically, rather than contradict, hit harmonizes beautifully with the rest of Scripture. Understanding the Difficult Words of Jesus, by David Bivin and Roy Blizzard jr. |
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| Lazarusty | Aug 15 2008, 08:45 PM Post #2 |
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But also remember - he who lives by the sword dies by the sword. We are not to take up arms against them if they come and arrest us for our faith. Jesus said we will be like lambs led to the slaughter. |
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| revcc | Aug 30 2008, 10:05 PM Post #3 |
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There are many many Christians in peace traditions (I myself am Mennonite) who chose to follow the plain teachings of Jesus on the futility of continuing the cycle of violence. Theologians have performed many linguistic tricks over the past 2000 years to tame Jesus' words and make them less subversive. If we only read the words of Jesus would we come to the same old just-war arguments? |
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| Ruth | Aug 30 2008, 10:56 PM Post #4 |
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We are not just to take the teachings of Jesus, but to be taught by all of scripture. The bible has many accounts of fighting and warfare. The New Testament commends Old Testament warriors for their military acts of faith (Hebrews 11). I don't recall reading anywhere in the New Testament where Jesus or the apostles had told a soldier or anyone in the military they should resign. Jesus told his disciples to carry a dagger to defend themselves against robbers and animals. John 15:12,13 This is my commandment, that you love one another, just as I have loved you. This is the greatest love, that one lay down his life for his friends. |
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| ASoftWind | Aug 30 2008, 11:44 PM Post #5 |
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Hi everyone... Newbie here. LOL The problem I see is that no one really considers the SPIRITUAL aspect of this....The fact that every single solitary day Christians use the sword of their mouth to cut others to shreds. Rather than 'covering the sin of their brother', they gleefully pat themselves on the back for exposing the error (in their own judgment, of course). Remember Noah's sin of overindulgence in the spirits (the liquid kind? lol)... His son Ham came in and saw him...but rather than cover his father's shame from prying eyes, he exposed it to his brothers... and HE was judged for that. When a Christian brother or sister uses the sword of their mouth to cut others, those wounds cut deep and are very painful sometimes. When I read "turn the other cheek" then, the Scripture comes ALIVE when suddenly you have to choose how to respond to someone using that sword on YOU. Do you pull out your own sword and cut off their ear (so that they will never again HEAR or entertain ANYTHING you every say again)? Or do you TURN THE OTHER CHEEK and respond with a meek and quiet Spirit? I choose the latter. |
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The Savior of all men, especially believers.1 Tim. 4:10. Jesus' words to those who wanted to call fire down on the heads of those not believing the Gospel,"You do not know what manner of spirit you are of. For the Son of Man did not come to destroy men’s lives, but to save them."(Lk 9:54-56). Blog | CARM Rebuttal | |
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| Israeli | Aug 31 2008, 12:36 AM Post #6 |
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Excellent point presented here. Covering their father's sin was done out of love, understanding and respect for him. I believe because they knew, he other wise, had a stellar character. But what to do about a history of impropriety in a brother who is prophecying to you? (I am not refering to ANY brother here at this forum. But there are some out there with known and un repentant sin.) Does Paul not teach to turn him over to Satan? Yes, as above, "Love COVERS a multitude of sin". Yes, even a multitude of sin. As we are through Jesus. But when do we use Paul's admonition to "deal" with the brother who is un repentant? Also, the scripture says " do not resist an EVIL man". Do resist the DEVIL, and he will flee from you. The Devil can't MAKE you do any thing. YOU choose to through his temptation. But, an evil man can. He won't flee from you. Edited by Israeli, Aug 31 2008, 12:39 AM.
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| ASoftWind | Aug 31 2008, 01:11 AM Post #7 |
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Hi Israeli! I will share something with you that happened to me on this very point.... It was a turning point for me, in both my relationship with the Lord, and my relations with others... Three years ago I was a member of a beautiful little forum group. I loved each and every one. But there was one person who always vehemently attacked anyone he perceived was wrong (according to him, of course)...His whole manner and spirit was wrong... He came across as overbearing, know-it-all, full of pride, uncompromising... His reactions were very fleshly. However there was no disputing that God had indeed given him revelation on certain other points (truly the Gifts of God are without repentance)...But in this one aspect of his character, he was completely blind to his sin. One day I posted a reply, and he immediately posted a sharply critical and public rebuke. The problem is, he wrongly accused me of something, and did so publicly without coming to me privately first (if he had, none of that would have ocurred). When I PM'd him, he denied having done that (as he had just removed it). Of course, he didn't realize I copied it into my wordprocessor in order to reply). When I replied (again by private PM) and asked if he realized that I copied it (thinking SURELY this would prompt an apology for not only wrongly accusing me, but also for then lying about it), his reaction was completely incredible... In not so many words.... He didn't care and wasn't going to apologize for anything. Now having felt the judgment of God upon me for far less, I was perplexed that this man who claims he follows the Lord, would have so little FEAR OF GOD as to do this without so much a concern that he would come under judgment for it. Well, I was hurt, to say the least... I followed the lawful 'rules' of heavenly court order, and appealed to the forum administrator...After all, I had appealed to him privately to no avail. I was legally correct to take it to the next level if I so wished. The administrator's response? "Please don't rock the boat." I was so hurt... How could he not only not correct this person (who btw, was an assigned moderator by the forum administrator), but do NOTHING concerning my perfectly justified right to have the matter heard? What happened next, totally floored me... I prayed and appealed to God... I asked HIM what shall I do? I attempted to handle it privately... I went to the administrator.... and I had a perfectly lawful right to post it PUBLICLY (take it to the 'congregation') next.... Do you want to know what the Lord said? He told me to "let it go".... but he followed it with, "I will judge Him." I was very hurt by this response from the Lord. I didn't understand. But I did just what He told me. I let it go. I just assumed that it meant God would judge Him at the Judgment Seat. The irony? Within one month this man, a moderator at the time, came under such judgment that he formally resigned his position as moderator... Suddenly he became as mild as a sheep...barely a whisper would come from his mouth, when he was such a lion before. And the forum admin who chose to do nothing? Well... he came under judgment as well... among other things, within a year, he died of a heart attack and his forum shut down. SO my answer, Israeli, in this very long drawn out way, is that I have learned to EXTEND GRACE to others, knowing that if there IS a word of judgment that I am to share, that GOD will give it to me and release me to say it. Otherwise, I say only what I hear the Father say, and do only what I see the Father do. |
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The Savior of all men, especially believers.1 Tim. 4:10. Jesus' words to those who wanted to call fire down on the heads of those not believing the Gospel,"You do not know what manner of spirit you are of. For the Son of Man did not come to destroy men’s lives, but to save them."(Lk 9:54-56). Blog | CARM Rebuttal | |
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| Israeli | Aug 31 2008, 01:17 AM Post #8 |
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Thank you Softwind. |
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| w8n4him | Aug 31 2008, 09:51 AM Post #9 |
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Amen ~ |
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| Deleted User | Sep 13 2008, 12:25 PM Post #10 |
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Thank you, Soft Wind, for those very wise words. The Lord is still dealing with me in how to speak the truth in love. You said in another post that we should let the Lord use fire to settle a matter: Let the ONE TRUE GOD answer by FIRE. If the WORDS YOU BELIEVE OR HAVE BEEN TAUGHT do not produce a SPIRIT OF BURNING in your heart and head.... If the WORDS YOU BELIEVE produce COMFORT and SECURITY concerning "where you're at" in your walk.... Then you have your evidence. You can put more wood (flesh) on it.... You can pile more offerings (words) upon it....But if it does NOT challenge you out of your comfort zone and cause a Spirit of BURNING in your heart as it does so, THEN IT IS NOT FROM THE ONE TRUE GOD. At times I feel what could be described as a burning desire to speak out when a lie is being presented as truth. In particular, I feel a need to protect those babes in Christ who are immature and have not learned discernment, somewhat like a mother bear defending her cubs. I asked the Lord about this last night, as some would say that we need to always behave in a soft and loving manner. He reminded me that when Jesus overturned the tables of the moneychangers, He also made a scourge and drove them out. John 2:15. He not only used the Sword of His mouth to tell them they had made the temple a den of thieves, but He physically drove them out of the temple. I would not consider this act to be in a soft and loving manner toward the moneychangers. I think the point is that in matters of holiness and reverence regarding the things of the Lord, that we are not to sit by idly and allow those things to be treated commonly, with disrespect. When lies are being sold as the truth, then we are to speak the truth, which Jesus told us will offend. Some would argue about how we know what we believe is the truth. I believe that the Holy Spirit, which dwells within each believer, will cause the truth to resonate within us. It is the fire of the Truth that singes the conscience of those who peddle lies for truth. |
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| SpiritIsWilling | Sep 13 2008, 01:22 PM Post #11 |
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 Amen Standardbearer!SoftWind, your post speaks volumes to me right now; very Holy Spirit filled words 
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Matthew 16:26 For what is a man profited, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul? or what shall a man give in exchange for his soul? 
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| justme | Sep 13 2008, 02:14 PM Post #12 |
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Regarding turning the other cheek I think Jesus was speaking of personal attacks. If we walk with God he will defend us so there is no need to do it ourselves. We should come to the aid of others, whether it be a physical or spiritual attack. Attacks of our character are to be answered by silence lest we begin to justify ourselves. If we are in the right then God will take care of it. I like to use this idea when someone tries to slander me, and that is that dead men do not have feelings. In saying that it does not imply we should not defend ourselves against criminal acts like murder. Robbery, I would think we would be prayed up enough to understand that no 'thing' is worth hurting someone over. Jesus said if someone asks you for your coat you should give him your cloak also. Putting more value on things than people only puts you in a selfish light. And no item is worth hurting someone, or being hurt, over. If you approach this in a selfless manner God will repay. He may not give you back what you lost because you may not have needed it anyway. But he will repay in a manner that is best. |
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